From: gaysforjesus647 [mailto:gaysforjesus647@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:02 AM
To: 'Brian Stehle'
Subject: RE: gays for jesus?
What bout verses 18-25 and verses 28-32? Do you abandon the story so you can pick out a verse that matches your concept of gays. "committed indecent acts" Tell me why when you meet the opposite sex then date then fall in love then marry you know this is not rape, abuse, adultery, etc. You say it is str8 process that ends up married (of course 60% end up divorce but that is not an issue to you). Now if gays meet date fall in love and marry in exactly the same process you did you call it " indecent acts". You worse yet say God punishes gays wish aids. This disease is quite tractable to its roots. It is a controversy in itself, but cutting past its history and get to today's facts percentagewise more str8s have aids. Children have aids. We would then have to condemn str8 women because God is punishing them with breast cancer. We can go group by group and find related conditioned to say God is a punisher instead of one who sent his Son to die on the Cross for "YOU".
Rom 1:18-32
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; (the story begins)
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. (The big picture)
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: (a ton of info is available)
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. (who are these THEY people? We are told they knew God and this had to begin as a child and gone through to adulthood when they were not thankful, became vain, and heart darkened. Now we have 650 million gays so they all should be this way. None should be good decent folk. The fact is most are very decent and beneficial to mankind which is provable in their careers and things they do for others.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, (650 million gays generally all ordinary people not boasting but generally humble and across the board behind the scenes. If they became fools then we would see massive numbers being obvious fools, but instead we see the health care field as an example that is provable should they leave it it would collapse. Employers often state gays are their best employees. These are fact not fools.)
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. (This verse says "str8 adults turned from GOD to gods" so we can see did gays grow up and change from Christianity to other regions? Many gays may not go to church because of people like you condemning them. But sorry to pop your bubble most gays in Christian backgrounds are Christian and don't turn from it when they grow up. Gay Atheists or agnostics are these in for the same reasons str8 are and many are likely to come back to Christ rather than turn further away.)
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. (Gave who? Those that turned to other gods. Keep in mind Paul wrote this inspired of God in the 1st century. So we have 1st century facts of what these THEY people did. We have the other gods then they went too, so we can name the gods and the rituals and the temple. Like in Moses day we have hard core fact people of God went to other gods and joined in their rituals. We know for an absolute fact these rituals were fertility rituals involve sodomite "temple prostitutes" We know many of these temple prostitutes cut of "junior" and dress like women to satisfied their mainly if not all str8 male clients. When Paul walk the streets of Rome and Corinth it can be said there was a fertility temple on every street corner. We know Paul went into a temple that had over 1000 temple prostitutes and that temple also had that statue to the unknown god Paul used in a later book. I went to Rome and did over 20 TV programs one was at the temple of the famous Cybele mother of the gods. I will in May of this year go to Corinth to do program at that ruin of the very temple that Paul went in that had the 1000 temple prostitutes. God gave these "THEY" people over to do there things and that is joining these fertility temple and participating in the ritual orgies. We got so much info about these prostitutes and orgies it is dumb founding how people like you can't see the issue was about Christians going to ritual orgies in these fertility temples. I went to Pompeii they have come to discover it was really sex sex sex and more sex. How you can confuse this with a gay couple in love should tell you that satan got blinders on you so you can't see. Only way people like you can see is when some crisis in your life forces you to take another look at life and you have life changing experience. It is too bad you just can't study and learn, but you need a crisis to show you. A crisis is coming and you won't like it, this crisis will result in huge numbers turning their backs on Jesus. Take your blinders off so the coming deception won't make that man over there seem like Jesus after all.)
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
(again you call the think you do with the opposite sex LOVE, but if gays do it you call it vile affection.
5446 phusikos (foo-see-kos'); from 5449; physical", i.e. (by implication) instinctive: KJV-- natural. Compare 5591. 5449 phusis (foo'-sis); from 5453; growth (by germination or expansion), i.e. (by implication) natural production (lineal descent); by extension, a genus or sort; figuratively, native disposition, constitution or usuage: KJV-- ([man-]) kind, nature ([-al]).
In Paul's day "nature and natural" was different, today we use a scientific notion. Shortened natural and natural is seed and instinct. This would mean if you wanted the verse to condemn gays that all gays would have first loved str8 sex and that is the sex they had up to when God made them gay in verse 24-25. Now FACTs should tell you that if you went to an orgy it would be very much vile. Without getting gory in details about real orgies there just is no love involved. There is no hint to a loving caring long term relationship between any of the participants. What more it is in worship to fertility gods. Paul really had a pet peeve concerning how Christians could go to these orgies. These details were given so it should be easy for you to recognize it is not about gays but about turning from GOD to gods. You say probably aids is the punishment here. FACT is gays don't go downhill like drug addiction or alcoholism or murderers or any sort of the like things that has a common result in destroying lives and take severe measure to change around. Gays instead live stable lives and generally have the things to live, house car for medical vacations otherwise nothing to indicate living as a gay person shows no sign of going downhill and destroying lives. People like you want to destroy gays lives. But in spite of people like you gays fair quite well in your persecutions. Gay Christians get prayers answered, they get blessings, they have the same hardships and blessing as any Christian. But in my 36 years as a gay Christian I see growth in gay Christian groups I see God working to prepare gays for an endtime ministry to restore people like you when you fall which there is a really good chance his will happen.)
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; (again 650 million gays worldwide it should be simple to see a pattern of reprobate minds and doing things which God details in the next few verses.)
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: (650 million gays if you look at the statistics and go to these gays and follow their lives you will see the opposite o f these things listed in these verse. They are pillars in their families in crisis, again they are employers best employees, they are great leaders, history records many. The list of good deeds would take forever. The only things you see they relates to misery is those gays that are being heavily persecuted and they have no or seek no means to seek truth, they accept their persecutors interpretation. Their families persecute them in the name your concept of gays thinking it is sin. Ex-gay leaders most comes from strict Catholic homes or Christian parents who constantly condemn them for being gay. These are sent to therapists and pastors that condemn gays. So churches love to put them on a pedestal when they lead a ex-gay group, but try to forget them if they fail to become str8. These are very few in numbers compared to the 650 million gays most go unheard as they live everyday ordinary lives. I know about them because I am a weekly TV preacher meaning I do my homework and know the facts.
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
(KJV) (gays do not get pleasure doing evil and they do not purposely live a way that they know will get them hell. Gay generally across the board live the best they can and the results are noticed like I said "best workers and bosses" They date and marry just like you. they party just like you. The mature just like you. They live just like you.
If you commit murder yes you are worthy of death, if you rape it should not go well with you. but if you love your wife have a means to live and support your life, a few good times, help a few, keeping your faith in God, then you are not in this verse. I have had thousands of miracles and answered prayers, 3 major physical instant healings. Uncountable blessing hundred of pastors prophesying over me good things of God. I been with my lover for 21 years. I own my house and cars outright. I am a manager in a large company with the keys and codes and the responsibly up to giving away everything in the store if I saw fit to it, of course that isn't a thing that ever happens it is just a policy for manager so to manage with confidence to make the right decisions. Last few years I have begun traveling around the world to shoot my TV programs while on vacations. The last ten years I have not had to spend any of my paycheck so retirement is promising in spite of the economy. My ministry is at the brink of growth like never before. Jesus talks with me, gives me visions and much more. I am gay, I am Pentecostal. It is you that needs to explain how you get gays into Romans 1:18-32. But even after I sent you detailed professional works into these verses you still come back with it is so simple. It is simple to you because you hate gays so you can't see the difference between love and rape. You can't see the difference between good works and evil works. For you gay is sin and nothing ever will change your mind. This is why it is most likely that if your love for Jesus is sincere you will come by way of truth through a crisis. Yet the Bible says people will say to this mountain fall on me rather than change their hatreds into love. You won't explain because you love your hatred. All you can say is " this is as simple as it gets.if you deny this then you deny the bible." You can't even explain the Bible. But I bet when you go to church your ears listen intently to your pastor explain the Bible using all means he can to show you what a word phrase of verse means back in the day it was written. The problem is put the word "gay" into the topic all reason goes out the window. Suddenly who cares about fact when you have your hatred to interrupt for you.
From: Brian Stehle [mailto:b_rye@rocketmail.com]
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 9:48 PM
To: gaysforjesus647
Subject: Re: gays for jesus?
this is as simple as it gets.if you deny this then you deny the bible.Romans 1:27
In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men(homosexuality) and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion(probably aids)
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